Alain de Botton reveals plans for ^temple to atheism^ in heart of London page 1

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 07:20 AM

Richard Dawkins is strongly against this (http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/jan/26/alain-de-botton-temple-atheism), so I am strongly in favour

MSG

27th January 2012, 07:27 AM

nope, this time, I agree with RD.

a temple of atheism? struth, kill me now...

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 07:29 AM

I agree with RD

Sickoid

MSG

27th January 2012, 07:47 AM

I do not subscribe to the principle that the enemy of my enemy is my friend :colbert:

http://trollcats.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/son_i_am_disappoint_trollcat.jpg

Adenosine

27th January 2012, 07:50 AM

I'd prefer if they gave the million pounds to charity. That's a lasting temple to atheism.

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 07:52 AM

I'd prefer if they gave the million pounds to charity. That's a lasting temple to atheism.

So utilitarian. Where's your passion for ethereal beauty?

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 07:53 AM

I do not subscribe to the principle that the enemy of my enemy is my friend :colbert:

http://trollcats.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/son_i_am_disappoint_trollcat.jpg

Richard Dawkins eats babies though

MSG

27th January 2012, 08:02 AM

the fact that Richard Dawkins is a self-important tosspot does not preclude Alain de Botton from being a self-important tosspot who disagrees with him

rudeigineile

27th January 2012, 08:09 AM

I agree with the op, I oppose everything Dawkins supports and support everything he opposes, like genocide, murder, child rape, putting half chewed gum on the seats of public transport .......

(I've oversnarked too early in the morning, I think I need to lie down)

Adenosine

27th January 2012, 08:22 AM

I'd prefer if they gave the million pounds to charity. That's a lasting temple to atheism.

So utilitarian. Where's your passion for ethereal beauty?

The look of wonderment on the face of a child who has finally tasted fresh water will be enough ethereal beauty for me. :cheer:

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 08:38 AM

Don't get me wrong everybody. If it weren't for Richard Dawkins opposing it, I would too. How can I get over this? I am an atheist suffering from PDSD (Post-Dawkins Stress Disorder), and I need kindness and effective therapies to get over it.

Or am I just a tosspot?

MSG

27th January 2012, 09:14 AM

the latter



but who isn't?

Hermit

27th January 2012, 10:29 AM

Alain da Bottomfeeder is clearly exploiting a marketing niche on the lunatic fringes of the atheist population. Reputedly being the world's richest philosopher, he is doing something right as a salesman, but I don't think we can infer from that that he is a good philosopher. In my opinion he is not even a philosopher at all. He is an entertainer with entrepreneurial flair.

Bottom proposes a £1 million atheist temple (oxymoron alert) because "It's time atheists had their own versions of the great churches and cathedrals." In so far as we need anything akin to temples, most universities and libraries will do, thanks. The money he hopes to raise would be better spent on making the Bodleian Library or the Smithsonian Institute more accessible. If I ever entertained the thought of worshipping in an atheist cathedral, I'd make a pilgrimage to the Large Hadron Collider. I'll leave the black, square 46 metre high shaft adorned with a golden band and inscribed with symbols to "atheists" who think placing their razor under a properly proportioned and aligned pyramidic wire frame keeps its blades sharper for longer.

I don't think particularly highly of Richard Dawkins as a person, (to put it mildly,) but I certainly agree with him on this: A temple of atheism is a contradiction in terms.

MSG

27th January 2012, 10:31 AM

if I wanted to make an atheist pilgrimage it would be to Makapangsat, Olduvai Gorge and Afar

Grumps

27th January 2012, 10:57 AM

Can we shotgun this guy's face? Not because I think he's somehow tarnishing the atheist brand, I couldn't give a shit about that, I just think he's a tosspot.

rudeigineile

27th January 2012, 11:00 AM

He could build a really nice building that could inspire awe and stick a school in it.

Sugreeva

27th January 2012, 04:36 PM

Can we shotgun this guy's face?
....

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 10:30 PM

Just how small is this temple going to be? £1m won't buy a one-bedroom house in the City of London. If he wants it 151ft high, it's going to have to be bloody thin.

It's a telegraph pole, isn't it? With a shed to hold it up.

Exi5tentialist

27th January 2012, 10:33 PM

Oh hang on, my mistake. It's £2m not £1m and "The dominant feeling you should get will be awe – the same feeling you get when you tip your head back in Ely cathedral," he said. "You should feel small but not in an intimidated way."

Bloody hell I didn't realise Ely was that cheap!

ConvolutedLogic

28th January 2012, 07:03 AM

deBottom is someone who just can't join the dots. In his recent TED talk, he seems to think that every atheist is just "barely holding it together", WTF? Has he just read some Sigmond Freud or something? :eek: Projecting perhaps?

I have seen better arguments from Robert Byers.

Exi5tentialist

28th January 2012, 08:51 AM

I'm still on Alain de Botton's side though, despite his obviously diminutive temple, because Richard Dawkins is against it.

Adenosine

28th January 2012, 01:22 PM

I like Dawkins. I like his biology, I like his writing, I like The God Delusion. I like that he didn't buy into the myth that religion is sacrosanct and not to be spoken badly about. And I like that he was vocal in his condemnation of the worst practices of organised religion. If it wasn't for people like Dawkins and Hitchens more "reasonable" atheists would never have been heard.

The only thing I don't like about him is how he allowed his cult of personality to take him over. But I'd still invite him to a dinner party.

Grumps

28th January 2012, 01:26 PM

I'm still on Alain de Botton's side though, despite his obviously diminutive temple, because Richard Dawkins is against it.


That's a bit petty and childish.

And dependant, actually. You're relying on Dawkins to make your opinion for you.

Grumps

28th January 2012, 01:27 PM

He could build a really nice building that could inspire awe and stick a school in it.

Like a fucking observatory.

MSG

29th January 2012, 04:18 AM

I like Dawkins. I like his biology, I like his writing, I like The God Delusion. I like that he didn't buy into the myth that religion is sacrosanct and not to be spoken badly about. And I like that he was vocal in his condemnation of the worst practices of organised religion. If it wasn't for people like Dawkins and Hitchens more "reasonable" atheists would never have been heard.

The only thing I don't like about him is how he allowed his cult of personality to take him over. But I'd still invite him to a dinner party.
Interesting. I can't stand him. Right from the time I read The Selfish Gene, when his descriptions of producing complex organism-like structures from a simple computer program had a weird quality, like he enjoyed playing God. I couldn't even finish The Extended Phenotype because of his overweening arrogance. I read River Out Of Eden and hated it, and swore I'd never read another Dawkins again.

charlou

29th January 2012, 09:41 AM

Oh hang on, my mistake. It's £2m not £1m and "The dominant feeling you should get will be awe – the same feeling you get when you tip your head back in Ely cathedral," he said. "You should feel small but not in an intimidated way."

Bloody hell I didn't realise Ely was that cheap!

Setting aside the arrogance of someone else trying to tell me how I should feel in any context .. the feeling he describes I find in appreciating nature.. I only have to see certain pictures of the Flinders Ranges to be transported to how I have felt since I first recognised those feelings as a child. Insignificant and yet connected, an intrinsic element of it all. Given all the bollocks in my life, this private and personal understanding has been liberating.

Adenosine

29th January 2012, 12:10 PM

I like Dawkins. I like his biology, I like his writing, I like The God Delusion. I like that he didn't buy into the myth that religion is sacrosanct and not to be spoken badly about. And I like that he was vocal in his condemnation of the worst practices of organised religion. If it wasn't for people like Dawkins and Hitchens more "reasonable" atheists would never have been heard.

The only thing I don't like about him is how he allowed his cult of personality to take him over. But I'd still invite him to a dinner party.
Interesting. I can't stand him. Right from the time I read The Selfish Gene, when his descriptions of producing complex organism-like structures from a simple computer program had a weird quality, like he enjoyed playing God. I couldn't even finish The Extended Phenotype because of his overweening arrogance. I read River Out Of Eden and hated it, and swore I'd never read another Dawkins again.

The sense I got was that he enjoyed debunking god, not playing god. That he takes immense pleasure in disproving IDiots' and Creationists' arguments. And when IDiots say that modern lifeforms couldn't have happened accidentally and Dawkins proves them wrong then I think he has a right to be smug.

I've only read a couple of his books and seen The Enemies of Reason and The Root of All Evil but I liked them. I didn't like how he acted during the RDF meltdown. That was the height of arrogance.

Free Falling

29th January 2012, 01:15 PM

Calling it a temple is stupid. Other than that, meh.

charlou

29th January 2012, 02:25 PM

Calling it a temple is stupid. Other than that, meh.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y171/charlou/whisper.gifApparently it's an atheistic phallic symbol ... a shrine to Richard Dawkins' rational prowess .. and RD is just too modest to go along with it, bless him. :)

FedUpWithFaith

31st January 2012, 04:39 AM

I say let him build his temple if he'll let me do what I wish I could do in religious temples - piss in it (and not in a toilet).

FedUpWithFaith

31st January 2012, 04:51 AM

It's been awhile since I've been in atheist forums. The last time I posted in Dawkin's forum it was after I'd already quit in disgust for what he'd let happen to the place (the ruination of the best atheist forum I was ever on - proudly for almost 3 years). I posted a scathing profane diatribe directed right at him, and partly because I wanted to get banned and make my "quitting" permanent.

Having said all that, I'm not sure he deserves all the emnity I'm reading here. What happened? Yeah, he's a pretentious blowhard and can be a shitheal who has made some big mistakes. But I've seen enough forum offshoots to see many atheists make mistakes just about as bad for reasons even more petty. Did I miss something else?

I still respect the guy, though not as much as I once did. He's been, on the whole, a net positive for atheism I think. But I never let myself get infatuated with him in the first place. It was never personal.

Hermit

31st January 2012, 05:25 AM

[Dawkins is]a pretentious blowhard and can be a shitheal who has made some big mistakes. [...] He's been, on the whole, a net positive for atheism:thumbsup:

...and nobody makes him look a better atheist than de Botton.

Cunt

31st January 2012, 05:37 AM

Welcome back, FedUpWithFaith! I can't TELL you how pleased I am to see you again!

FedUpWithFaith

31st January 2012, 05:39 AM

[Dawkins is]a pretentious blowhard and can be a shitheal who has made some big mistakes. [...] He's been, on the whole, a net positive for atheism:thumbsup:

...and nobody makes him look a better atheist than de Botton.

Never heard of the guy before today. But if half of what you wrote earlier about him is true, and I give you credit for telling many half-truths ;], then he can only hurt atheists.

How many times do we have to argue with the faithful that atheism is not a faith, religion, or worldview? Any type of shrine undermines that.

Cunt

31st January 2012, 05:41 AM

Why not build a temple to atheists? (couldn't be to atheism...I would vomit into my mouth)

I think the best value this could provide would be protection from religious persecution. Like shelter for an abortion factory. Or a secure place where dozens of fat, indolent contrarians can slurp each others genitals. Or a place where much more money is tax exempt.

Ooohhh, how about claiming religious sanctuary for atheists who can't access such at a church because of compulsive integrity?

FedUpWithFaith

31st January 2012, 06:11 AM

Why not build a temple to atheists? (couldn't be to atheism...I would vomit into my mouth)

I think the best value this could provide would be protection from religious persecution. Like shelter for an abortion factory. Or a secure place where dozens of fat, indolent contrarians can slurp each others genitals. Or a place where much more money is tax exempt.

Ooohhh, how about claiming religious sanctuary for atheists who can't access such at a church because of compulsive integrity?

You don't sound serious but I'll respond as if you were old friend. Shrines are built for great ideals, ideas, men/women, and worldviews of purpose. Atheism is none of these. It should be a mundane idea but for the juxtaposition of scurilous religious faith that tricks us into thinking it might be more.

I suppose a temple can be a sanctuary from persecution but only if the wider population accepts that purpose. In a persecuting religious world an athiest sanctuary would only serve as a convenient corral for extermination. There are better secular alternatives.

Sugreeva

31st January 2012, 06:45 AM

Shrine to YHWH:
http://www.teslasociety.com/pictures/sistine.jpg

Shrine to atheism:
http://www.photogalaxy.com/pic/planetearth-59/auschwitz_gateway.jpg

charlou

31st January 2012, 02:59 PM

eat babies. seriously. they're delicious.

Sugreeva

31st January 2012, 04:03 PM

History's greatest murderers were atheists and cannibals:
Stalin
Charles Darwin
Adolf Hitler
Dan Barker
moa tse tung

FedUpWithFaith

31st January 2012, 04:20 PM

And me - Christians are tasty

Sugreeva

31st January 2012, 04:59 PM

Stalin
Charles Darwin
Adolf Hitler
Dan Barker
moa tse tung
Elouise
FedUpWithFaith

PermanentlyEphemeral

31st January 2012, 05:48 PM

[Dawkins is]a pretentious blowhard and can be a shitheal who has made some big mistakes. [...] He's been, on the whole, a net positive for atheism:thumbsup:

...and nobody makes him look a better atheist than de Botton.

Never heard of the guy before today. But if half of what you wrote earlier about him is true, and I give you credit for telling many half-truths ;], then he can only hurt atheists.

How many times do we have to argue with the faithful that atheism is not a faith, religion, or worldview? Any type of shrine undermines that.

Well as long as there are very faithful atheists you will have to continue to argue.

charlou

1st February 2012, 01:05 AM

And me - Christians are tasty

You're a convert? No wonder you're no longer smart enough for Mafia.

FedUpWithFaith

1st February 2012, 02:16 AM

And me - Christians are tasty

You're a convert? No wonder you're no longer smart enough for Mafia.

Huh? I guess not. i can't even figure this out.

I was suggesting like you, an atheist who likes to eat babies, I'm an atheist who likes to eat Christians. I also enjoy picking their crucifixes out of my stool.

FedUpWithFaith

1st February 2012, 02:19 AM

Oh wait, I think I get it. You meant I used to prefer eating some other type of human (like babies, hence a "convert"). Is that right?

OK, as you see, my mind has degraded drastically since we last fucked talked. Obviously, I'm not worthy of the Mafia.

charlou

1st February 2012, 03:12 AM

I meant you, a christian? wanting to be eaten? what the? or something .. the moment has passed.

I think I had my teeth around your leg at the time. I will put it down now and be serious.

Cunt

1st February 2012, 03:20 AM

I
wish you wouldn't

FedUpWithFaith

1st February 2012, 04:43 AM

I meant you, a christian? wanting to be eaten? what the? or something .. the moment has passed.

I think I had my teeth around your leg at the time. I will put it down now and be serious.

I
wish you wouldn't

Let her put it down. I have another "limb" I'd rather she put in her mouth.